Help... Need Advice

[DXeXodus]

Is this a good deal? A computer company here in CT has a special on at the moment. It is as follows:

AMD dual Core 4800+
4GB DDR2 800 RAM
500GB SATA2 HDD
nVidia GeForce 8600GT 512MB
Samsung 22" wide LCD
Thermaltake Mambo case
Thermaltake 650Watt PSU
Logitech mouse and keyboard
Creative 4.1 Surround sound system

R8250.00 incl Vat.

My current PC is:

AMD single core 64bit 3000+
3Gb DDR 400 RAM
80GB IDE HDD
320GB SATA2 HDD
XFX nVidia Geforce 7900GT 256MB
19" Proline flat CRT
Creative 5.1 Surround sound system

I want an upgrade, but I'm strapped for cash. As my fellow nagling forumites, what would u suggest? Should I sell my system and buy the one on special? or just wait and upgrade bits of what I got? (I know the graphics card kinda sucks... but is it better than what I currently have?)

Help me Noleen! desperate and alone
Signed: ANONYMOUS

[wir]

No tech guru, but that doesn't look too great it my eyes. As GLDM will surely tell you, the 8600GT is a big no-no. A higher up AMD dualcore might be better too, along the lines of the 5000 to 6000.

[Chevron]

@DXeXodus. Your pc is more than fine. Just get a dual core processor.

That's honestly all you need.

[DXeXodus]

No tech guru, but that doesn't look too great it my eyes. As GLDM will surely tell you, the 8600GT is a big no-no. A higher up AMD dualcore might be better too, along the lines of the 5000 to 6000.

I realise that.. But the prices jump quite alot after that for both the G/cards and processors

[Chevron]

@DXeXodus Just get a 5600+ it's Price: R 1,557
http://www.take2.co.za/electronics-amd-athlon64-x2-5600-dual-core-cpu-socket-am2-2315496.html

[DXeXodus]

@DXeXodus. Your pc is more than fine. Just get a dual core processor.

That's honestly all you need.

My PC is really struggling with assassins creed. Would a DC processor really solve this even if I only have a 7900GT?

[wir]

@DXeXodus Just get a 5600+ it's Price: R 1,557
http://www.take2.co.za/electronics-amd-athlon64-x2-5600-dual-core-cpu-socket-am2-2315496.html
Or the 6000+ for R1700.
http://www.matrixonlineshop.co.za/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=7&products_id=161&osCsid=4039632043274d115febeea26de67819

If affordable, get the 8800GT too, goes for about R2200.
http://www.prophecy.co.za/inno3d-8800gt-512mb-overclocked-p-23492.html

With that, you'll have a system similar to mine, and be able to run Crysis at high. Assassin's Creed shouldn't have any problems.

Remember, the 7900GT isn't that bad yet. I had it until March. Upgrading my CPU at that time to a 6000+ gave a pretty big boost. 3dmark06; from about 2000, to 5000-6000 if I remember correctly.

[Chevron]

My PC is really struggling with assassins creed. Would a DC processor really solve this even if I only have a 7900GT?

In one word.

YES.

[wir]

In one word.

YES.
He's right.

That 3000+ is really holding you back, believe me. I had the 3500+ with the 7900GT.

[DXeXodus]

Oh Ok, I didnt realise that a DC processor would make such a difference. So basically my system is being held back by having a single core processor. Thanks Chevron

Anyone else wanna confirm this? Or any other ideas?

EDIT: @wir: cool. Thanks man

[MrDeVil_909]

In one word.

YES.

QFT

The 7900 is still a good card, the only thing the 8600 brings to the table is (poor) DX 10 support and slower speeds.

[CrashHelmut]

Also, you would probably see very little increase if you go from a Nvidia 7900GT to a 8600GT.

If you want to upgrade to a good mid-range graphics card, I can recommend the 9600GT which offers great performance for the price. (Also consider the ATI 3850 if your budget is tight).

[Darkmag]

Oh Ok, I didnt realise that a DC processor would make such a difference. So basically my system is being held back by having a single core processor. Thanks Chevron

Anyone else wanna confirm this? Or any other ideas?

EDIT: @wir: cool. Thanks man

Your GFX cards is bottlenecked by your CPU, and if you upgrade you GFX then you stil sit with a bottleneck. So get rid of the bottleneck. a 6000+ will work http://www.prophecy.co.za/-c-19_27_253_256.html

and a article of CPUvs GPU
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/cpu-gpu-upgrade,1928-3.html

ALSO you might want to look at this the 3000+ vs the 6000+
(http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/cpu-charts-2007/prey,387.html?p=1271%2C1308%2C1267%2C1260%2C1249%2 C1246%2C1247%2C1237%2C1235%2C1234%2C1300%2C1231%2C 1304%2C1299%2C1298%2C1297%2C1225%2C1223%2C1279%2C1 287%2C1317%2C1285%2C1218%2C1282%2C1310%2C1309)

[DXeXodus]

Thanks for the advice.

I have read that article from TomsHardware and I found it interesting. The only problem with it is that it doesn't speak about single core processors. So the 11% increase that they show for the 7series nVidia card will be more in my case as I will be going from single core to dual core.

[Darkmag]

Thanks for the advice.

I have read that article from TomsHardware and I found it interesting. The only problem with it is that it doesn't speak about single core processors. So the 11% increase that they show for the 7series nVidia card will be more in my case as I will be going from single core to dual core.

Well single core vs dual core vs quad core in games don`t yield huge results. But your system is heavily bottlenecked by your CPU

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/7416/warhammeroa2.jpg
http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/7968/supremeof7.jpg
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/450/seriouswe8.jpg
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/4041/quakeivlc3.jpg
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/7144/preyny1.jpg

So as you can see in your system your CPU is holding you back. You can also see the diffrence between dual core and quad core.

[DXeXodus]

Wow... that is quite a difference.
OK. I only really have the cash for the AMDX2 5200+. Would that still do the job of stopping the bottleneck problem?

[Chevron]

Wow... that is quite a difference.
OK. I only really have the cash for the AMDX2 5200+. Would that still do the job of stopping the bottleneck problem?

Yes. Anything above a 4600+ should be fine.

[Frozenfireside]

I cannot really say anything else then what has been said.
Your current setup isn't bad you just need to poke it in the right areas.
You will save a lot of money by just buying a new CPU and GPU over a complete PC.
I say 8800GT as well but get 1 more gig of RAM so your system runs in full dual channel mode.

[DXeXodus]

Cool! i think I will toddle off and buy a 4800+ then or maybe a 5200+. Thanks for the help guys. I'll let you know how it works out :)

[DXeXodus]

get 1 more gig of RAM so your system runs in full dual channel mode.

It is in full dual channel mode I think:

Slot 1: 1GB DDR 400
Slot 2: 1GB DDR 400
Slot 3: 512MB DDR 400
Slot 4: 512MB DDR 400

I am suddenly filled with the excitement at the thought that I might be able to run AC at more than 10fps

[Frozenfireside]

Ok cool ^_^ Hey you running Vista yet?

[DXeXodus]

Ok cool ^_^ Hey you running Vista yet?


NO! no no no... My girlfriend has vista on her laptop and I find it is kinda like trying to run a lap around an underwater track in one of those big-daddy style dive suits. Lets just say that vista and I aren't friends yet and wont be until I'm utterly convinced.

Why? my card isn't DX10 anyway so there would be no point

[Phantom_ZA]

Remember that Assassin's Creed is extremely cpu demanding. My friend and I both have a 7900GT except he runs AC with 40fps more due to him having a superior processor.
So as previously stated a major cpu upgrade will definitely display significance.

[DXeXodus]

My friend and I both have a 7900GT except he runs AC with 40fps more due to him having a superior processor.

Is AC so demanding on CPU because of all the AI in terms of crowds etc? Because I find that on my current system I can run it well on high indoors, but as soon I get into a crowded street it dies a sudden death. (not a beautiful death ;) )

Well, Im going to go buy a new processor in exactly 30 Minutes so its all good. Just hope the performance increase is worth the pennies.

[MrDeVil_909]

It's mostly the draw distance, because it is an open world when you are in open areas it needs to render the visible sections of the world. Oblivion has a similar problem on older machines. Although the AI could be a factor.

[ImANinjaItsTrue]

um

no one has asked you what res you play at.this is important.it depends what size screen u have really.
im guessing you have a 17" and a res around 1024 by 768.if this is true then i would stick to the 7900for now,itl do fine at that res on medium settings for a little longer.it is a real pity you are stuck with an amd mobo.the war was won by intel a way back,and their dual core solutions pip amd at pretty much every price point.You could also do with an upgrade to ddr2 ram, your current memory bandwidth will clip dual cores wings.

if it were me,i would look at replacing mobo, ram and cpu for now. you could do it nicely for about 5000. If you are in joburg, go to a place called pcinternational in radburg.their pricing is amazing,better than most local online retailers, and u dont have to wait for delivery.they also have fantastic service when it comes to warranties and replacing stuff that breaks.

acutally i dont know why i am even typing this in light of your last post.
stoping............now

[Chevron]

My current PC is:

AMD single core 64bit 3000+


Socket 754,939 or am2?

[eskimoKID]

It's a pretty good deal, but you'll have to upgrade the GFX card if you want to run your games @ the 22" Screen's 1650x1080 native res.

[Phantom_ZA]

Is AC so demanding on CPU because of all the AI in terms of crowds etc? Because I find that on my current system I can run it well on high indoors, but as soon I get into a crowded street it dies a sudden death. (not a beautiful death ;) )

Well, Im going to go buy a new processor in exactly 30 Minutes so its all good. Just hope the performance increase is worth the pennies.

Yes especially when one ventures into a city.
Anyway you should report back to us when you acquire your new cpu.

[DXeXodus]

OK... so heres the deal. My hopes and dreams were shattered yesterday when I walked into the PC shop... The guy says that my PC wont take a dual core cos its socket 939 (or they dont have any... he was kinda vague. But, I checked my mobo box and it says it is dual core ready. Its a Gigabyte K8Triton nForce4 SLI board, socket 939. Are the dual cores for these not available or are they crap or what? They only seem to have AM2 processors which I'm guessing wont fit into my mobo. yay. So now, I have R1000 for a new processor, but apparantly (according to the dude) I'd have to buy a new mobo and new ram as a result. But I dont have the cash :(

*hangs head and sheds a silent tear*

Is it possible to get socket 939 X2 processors? And what are they like? Will it be much slower than an AM2?

Anyone got any ideas?
Anyone have a 939 X2 that they wanna sell me? in CT?


im guessing you have a 17" and a res around 1024 by 768.

I stated in my opening post at the start of the thread that I have a 19" flat CRT. It can support up to 1600x1200 Resoloution. I am happy to run my games in 1024x768 or 1280x1024, so long as it runs within an acceptable fps range.

[Chevron]

Is it possible to get socket 939 X2 processors? And what are they like? Will it be much slower than an AM2?

Anyone got any ideas?
Anyone have a 939 X2 that they wanna sell me? in CT?


You're gonna have a very hard time finding a 939 cpu. AMD discontinued that socket.

I say check pc shops in your area. You might get lucky with one that has old stock or try get one second hand.

It's not worth it yet for you to redo your whole pc. Especially when someone takes your budget into account.

Your second best bet is to get a am2 board that takes DDR400. That way you're saved the expense of the ram.

Another question. Is your GFX card AGP or PCI express?

[DXeXodus]

That is sad news. I have been looking in some of the classifieds, but no luck yet.
The guy at the PC shop also mentioned that there are going to be AM3's soon... is that true? He says buying an AM2 now would be silly...


Another question. Is your GFX card AGP or PCI express?

It is PCI express.

[Chevron]

The guy at the PC shop also mentioned that there are going to be AM3's soon... is that true? He says buying an AM2 now would be silly...


Yes am3s are coming soon. They'll support DDR3.

Whether it's silly going am2 now depends on what you have and your budget.

It's gonna cost way too much to build you a whole pc, especially when all you need for the current one is a cpu.

Just try get a dual core 939. Then when that starts to not be enough, then get a whole new pc. Not before.

[DXeXodus]

Ok... my search shall continue. It appears that DDR400 mobo's are equally hard to find.
*sigh*

If anyone on these forums know of a place to find either a socket 939 AMD X2 processors - 4600+ or bigger, or AM2 motherboard with DDR 400slots please let me know. (even online retailers will do) Thanks

[Zen]

Ok... my search shall continue. It appears that DDR400 mobo's are equally hard to find.
*sigh*

If anyone on these forums know of a place to find either a socket 939 AMD X2 processors - 4600+ or bigger, or AM2 motherboard with DDR 400slots please let me know. (even online retailers will do) Thanks

Well the highest X2 you shall find for a socket 939 is the 4800 X2, which I managed to to get when their prices crashed I picked up a R6k processor for R2499, and it works like a charm. You will be very hard pressed to find a socket 939 processor these days.

My only recommendation would to be, go looking at the cheaper C2D and a decent C2D motherboard, and just upgrade those parts with a decent set of (minimum) 2GB DDR2.

Core 2 Duo E6550 (http://www.prophecy.co.za/intel-core2-e6550-dual-core-233ghz-with-vttxt-p-22515.html)

[MrDeVil_909]

Ok... my search shall continue. It appears that DDR400 mobo's are equally hard to find.
*sigh*

If anyone on these forums know of a place to find either a socket 939 AMD X2 processors - 4600+ or bigger, or AM2 motherboard with DDR 400slots please let me know. (even online retailers will do) Thanks

You are looking at exactly why I went for the Xbox 360. It was either that or a R6000+ platform upgrade.

The Socket 939 dual cores were released at twice the price of the Intel dual cores, then when you would have reasonable expected a price decrease they dropped the whole platform for the AM2. I have no time for AMD.

[H1TMAN]

I'm also looking for a 4400+ amd 939 dual core .
On eBay there are plenty but the problem is its too risky to import it and the price is still abit expensive . You looking at min. R800 for a very old cpu .
The only other thing I can think of is contacting AMD South Africa . I'm sure they got some old stock .
I'll post back here if I get any news on that cpu

[MrDeVil_909]

I'll post back here if I get any news on that cpu

Cool, I would still like to upgrade, but wouldn't recommend anyone holds their breath.

[DXeXodus]

Well, it looks like I'm gonna have to go through a dry gaming run while I save up to do a proper upgrade. Old games here we come.

*blows dust off system shock 2*

[wir]

That is sad news. I have been looking in some of the classifieds, but no luck yet.
The guy at the PC shop also mentioned that there are going to be AM3's soon... is that true? He says buying an AM2 now would be silly...
Just by the way, AM2 and AM3 are cross compatible if I'm not mistaken.

[DXeXodus]

Think I might just sell my PC once Ive got some more cash and buy a new setup... gonna be a while though. It will be cool if AM2 and AM3 are cross-compatible. But DDR3 will not work in the old boards and vice versa (I assume)

[Frozenfireside]

http://www.sybaritic.co.za/store/product_info.php?cPath=21_352&products_id=8665
AMD Opteron 150 2400Mhz (1 channel) Socket 939
R2,536.00
Damn nice CPUs those opterons. pity its a touch pricey.

[DXeXodus]

http://www.sybaritic.co.za/store/product_info.php?cPath=21_352&products_id=8665
AMD Opteron 150 2400Mhz (1 channel) Socket 939
R2,536.00
Damn nice CPUs those opterons. pity its a touch pricey.


Really? Isn't that an old processor? I'm probably just being ignorant....

[H1TMAN]

Just wait till august this year . prices will come down and you'll be able to get a kick-ass pc. Save up till you have R8000. sell everything if you have to :p

[DXeXodus]

Well, this weekend I managed to get hold of a friends old socket 929 AMDX2 processor for R300. Its only a 3800+ so not that great, but it has increased my performance alot. I can run Assassins Creed well on med-high graphics (compared to terribly on low) which makes me happy because I can finally play this game :). My 3D mark score only went up a few hundred points, but it doesnt matter, because the dual core processor seems to handle lots of AI and background stuff a lot better. So that will have to do for now. Cheers to everyone for the advice.

[MrDeVil_909]

Nice, now that is a value for money upgrade.

[eskimoKID]

Kewl, glad you found a solution..not ripped off either.

[Frozenfireside]

Really? Isn't that an old processor? I'm probably just being ignorant....

Yes. It is.
Glad you got a new CPU though.

[DXeXodus]

I am too :)

By the way, what are the best utilities for overclocking CPU and Graphics cards? I dont think RivaTuner works for the 7900's - well, so I have read on the net.

[Phantom_ZA]

Don't consider overclocking your cpu unless you have an after market cooler.

[DXeXodus]

Don't consider overclocking your cpu unless you have an after market cooler.

Don't worry, I'm aware of that. Just wanna know which utilities to use

[Chevron]

Don't worry, I'm aware of that. Just wanna know which utilities to use

You already have the utility to overclock your cpu with. It's called the BIOS. :)

[DXeXodus]

Ah yes... excuse my ignorance :)