Zuma and the Church

[Chuluka]

This is really beginning to look like South Africa is heading towards a dictatorship.

Read article here

[onona]

Such a cheap shot, going for moral blackmailing through the religious organisations. Right now, I really have no response other than:

:/

[Chuluka]

South Africa doesn't have a state religion! Zuma should not have been allowed to campaign in the Rhema Church in the first place. This is really going too far.

[Graal]

Well, there's not much we can do anyway, is there? All we can do is sit back and watch this country go down the drain. And I'm sorry for anyone who disagrees, but that's exactly what's going to happen eventually.

[Domanskip]

Yeah this country has been a lost cause for ages now. From apartheid to this...
Anyone who thinks otherwise truly is deluded.

[onona]

inb4 IF UR NOT PART OF THE SOLUTION UR PART OF THE PROBLEM!!11

[Graal]

inb4 IF UR NOT PART OF THE SOLUTION UR PART OF THE PROBLEM!!11

What solution?

[onona]

It was a follow-on to Domanskip's post about people who delude themselves.

[Graal]

It was a follow-on to Domanskip's post about people who delude themselves.

Ah, my bad.

[Ajust]

All optimistic visions of the south african future aside ([/sarcasm]), this reminds me of when Mugabe said "only God" can remove him from office.

[Chuluka]

All optimistic visions of the south african future aside ([/sarcasm]), this reminds me of when Mugabe said "only God" can remove him from office.

QFE

Thats exactly why this is beginning to get out of hand.

[Wesley]

We're not shy to encourage everyone to vote for the organisation because there is no other organisation with as rich a history as ours.

Well, I'm sure there are organisations and parties with less blundering idiots in their midst.

To the ANC, I say this: You've won the war against Apartheid, you've won back the country your ancestors first inhabited, and you've done a lot of good for the country. Now, please step down and end this ****ing monopoly so that we can carry on making a good name for ourselves, instead of having you twits drag us through the mud again. Oh, and please stop bringing up the Apartheid thing to use to your advantage - its done, its over, and Madiba himself hammered the nails into its coffin, now let it go.

[Visi_Ace]

Since Zuma is using Christianity in this case I have the following to say from my point of view:

I agree that this is taking things too far. Zuma today said that "if God is for the ANC who can be against them?".

Depending if God is really for (with) someone well, God Himself can be against that someone. There are a number of examples in the Bible of where people thought God was with them or where leaders told the army that God was with them. That provided them and the people with false sense of security, but in fact the leaders were actually just trying to use God for their own gain or as a tool to persuade the army or instill fear onto the enemy. As you can see in this reference things do not work that way. People cant use God for their gain, it works other way around.

[Higushi]

I'm still optimistic. This election could be interesting, perhaps changing the face of South African politics for the better.

Politicians are always going to grab at anything that might gain them votes, the church included. This we know. But I do find it very sad that the church, an institution with supposed good moral grounding and virtue, would openly support a man convicted of rape and corruption.

It all boils down to the mindset of the people in the communities, they can't think for themselves or see the situation clearly - I know this because I live literally right next to one of the biggest informal settlements in SA and have spoken to many about politics - they are blinded by the lingering fog of liberation.

I feel that with the formation of this new party - COPE - that if the ANC does not do its job in the next term of leadership, the people might start to think twice about their future and begin to change their vote to them. I'm hoping this has begun already and we see results in this election. It would be a great step in the right direction for the future of SA politics.

[Ajust]

I'm still optimistic. This election could be interesting, perhaps changing the face of South African politics for the better.

Politicians are always going to grab at anything that might gain them votes, the church included. This we know. But I do find it very sad that the church, an institution with supposed good moral grounding and virtue, would openly support a man convicted of rape and corruption.

It all boils down to the mindset of the people in the communities, they can't think for themselves or see the situation clearly - I know this because I live literally right next to one of the biggest informal settlements in SA and have spoken to many about politics - they are blinded by the lingering fog of liberation.

I feel that with the formation of this new party - COPE - that if the ANC does not do its job in the next term of leadership, the people might start to think twice about their future and begin to change their vote to them. I'm hoping this has begun already and we see results in this election. It would be a great step in the right direction for the future of SA politics.

Glad to I'm not the only forumite optimistic about the coming elections :/

[Q-Man]

I firmly believe that Government and Religion should be two completely separate and unrelated entities. Together they're a dangerous force. Politicians shouldn't be allowed to preach in religious communities, and in the event that a religious figure become an electable politician, one of the offices should be forfeit.

You can't be a politician AND a priest; it's inherently contradictory; one serves God, the other serves Man, so which is it?

That's not to say Politicians can't be religious, or that Priests and such can't be political - they just shouldn't let them mix in the context of the other.

Truthfully, Zuma isn't doing anything wrong here - he's being a politician; the head of the church, though, should re-evaluate his stance :P

[dammit]

The church's support for the ANC was an "unequivocal biblical declaration that if God is for us who can be against us," party president Jacob Zuma said on Wednesday.

I lol'd

[HolyMackerel]

I think COPE is going to give the ANC a run for their money. . . Poor man thinks he can now sit back and God will sort everything out for him. . .

[wrathex]

Oh, but NO, because I remember clearly the St James Church Massacre:

Let me quote for you :

"The Pan Africanist Student Organisation (PASO) and the Azanian National Youth Unity (AZANYU) said that they were perplexed and shocked at the level of reaction to "the killing of only 11 European settlers" at St. James Church.

The statement said that as churches were counter-revolutionary they were legitimate targets of war.

The weapons and ammunitions that were possessed by the applicants were supplied by APLA and were possessed by the applicants for the purpose of carrying out this operation. Such possession was therefore an act associated with a political objective. "

What can I say ?

[theDamaged]

Zuma forgets though when he says "God is for us", one of the cornerstones of Christian belief (as far as I know) is free will. That is why they say the Devil can tempt man (not being gender specific here) because we have the right to choose.

Therefore God is not for or against anyone, he basically says, Dude live your life, I will let you know how well you did at the end. Also how can Zuma claim to be a Christian and a pastor to boot when he has like a gazillion wives?

I have no doubt Jacob assface Zuma will be our next prez but I don't think they will get the 2/3 majority and hopefully this will be a wakeup call to them that they can't keep screwing us, that or I am being totally naive